Work You Love and Lives You Shape, with Sheldon and Thelma

Thelma: [00:00:00] I would say you don't have to have your life figured out at 17 or even at 70. 

Yarden: This is Bina, a Better Together podcast from the students and faculty of Contra Costa Midrasha, where Jewish students, mentors, and elders sit down to share stories and trade wisdom. I'm Yarden Crane. Today I am co-hosting with fellow Better Together teens, Aviva Feder and Nolan Valdivia.

Today we're talking with Sheldon Schwartz and Thelma Bronet, who are active participants and lifelong members of Better Together in Congregation B’nai Tikvah. We think you'll be inspired to hear their life's wisdom. We'll be right back with Sheldon Schwartz and Thelma Bronet. 

(music break)

We like to start each podcast with just, if you guys could introduce yourselves and say two things that are important to you just so we can get to know you a little bit and how maybe we wanna start this conversation, I guess.

Sheldon: Thelma, you wanna start? 

Thelma: [00:01:00] Uh, my name is Thelma Bronet. I use my maiden name. Um, and two things that are important are my family. I'll put family and friends and Midrasha. 

Sheldon: And my name is Sheldon middle initial H. Schwartz. Um, I, I think that the most important thing is, uh, is family, especially at this age. Uh, when I was much younger, there were different priorities, but right now, close to 90 years old and family has taken on a, a very important part.

The, uh, the other thing is I'm concerned maybe overly so, uh, about the world situation. 

Yarden: Hi, my name's Yarden Crane. Um, I think. Going on the same thing as you guys. Like, a big thing that's important to me and within my everyday life is family. I love being with my family and I spend a lot of time with them.

And I also love just learning [00:02:00] new things and helping others. 

Aviva: So my name's Aviva Feder and um, I think that two things that are really important to me are my family and friends and the people I surround myself with. And probably like Judaism and community. 

Nolan: I'm Nolan and I'm a sophomore at Monte Vista High School.

Uh, two things that are really important to me are, uh, playing baseball. I'll do three things, playing baseball, hanging out with friends, and public address announcing. I love broadcasting and every aspect about it, and I look forward to a career path in there. 

Aviva: What do you guys have, like wisdom for your teenage self.

So what did you wish you knew? At our age or like at any younger age, like especially when you were a teenager, what did you wish you knew when you were a teenager?

Yarden: or some wisdom to us, I guess. If you had advice for us, what would your advice be? 

Thelma: I would say you don't have to have your life figured out at 17 or even at 70.

I was concerned about what I was gonna be and [00:03:00] what I was gonna do. And there's it, it's kind of like taking a hike. You know? It's not just one road, it's like a step ladder. It's not like a step ladder, it's like a winding road and things can change and um, life can change and throw you curves. So that's one of my big things is don't worry that you don't have things figured out yet.

Yarden: I think that's something that is so prevalent in my life right now. Especially I'm a senior and college apps, and so the number one question I get is, where are you with your college apps and where are you going to college and what are you gonna major in? And I think it's something like that it's an expectation of like, oh, you need to know what you wanna major in and what you wanna do.

But also I agree with you of like, you know, you never will know unless you try it out and you have to try out those different things. And maybe you start with one thing and you like another, just the different. Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Sheldon: As I [00:04:00] reflect, there are two things that are extremely, uh, salient in my life. One is to make sure that as you proceed with your teenage and adult life, that you always, always are taking account of the risk versus the utility of what it is that you're doing.

Um, as an example, if you are in a car with friends and they're driving at 80 miles an hour. Or they are, uh, inebriated. What you wanna do is you wanna take your two hands and you wanna measure physically the risk versus the utility of that, and you wanna get out of the car. So as you proceed with your studies and your life and your work, and the friends you [00:05:00] hang out with and the things you do and the desires you have and the people you meet, you wanna always be measuring the risk, which is the downside versus the utility of what you're doing.

Risk versus utility. It has a great application. The other thing that is extremely important, that will be hard for you to understand, but you asked me the question and I have to be honest with you, and that is, at this point in your life, if you haven't already, you wanna be very, very close to your relationship with your parents. You wanna make sure that they love you deeply and that you love them deeply.

And if you don't have a sense of that love coming from them, you wanna find out why. Because the lack of love, as I grew up affected my entire life and probably [00:06:00] gave me the personality that you're looking at right now. Turned out pretty positive, but, uh, didn't have to, except for some very serious discipline on my part.

So those two things are extremely important. Were important to me and hopefully will be to you. 

Thelma: And I'd like to just add one more thing that, um, it's okay to make mistakes. Mistakes, um, are just simply detours. And, um, I think you can gain a lot of wisdom from making mistakes. 

Nolan: What Jewish value means a lot to you.

We'll start with, with Sheldon. 

Sheldon: I think I found it here at this, at this temple. And it is, is the, uh, relationship between the, uh, rabbi and the congregation and the rabbi and me. The music is absolutely lovely. Um, the camaraderie, uh, with the people who are here is, uh, [00:07:00] overwhelming. I just, it's home. It's the second home and I love it.

Nolan: Absolutely. What about you, Thelma? 

Thelma: Um, well I think we discussed it Sunday. Um, some of those values really hit home justice, hope, compassion, um, all those seven values that we talked about. Um, and I really identify, I think Jews traditionally have those values and hopefully we understand them and carry them forward and teach them to our children who will teach them to their children.

Yarden: Do you think it was very prominent in your childhood? Were you taught those values when you grew up? 

Thelma: Uh, we were unaffiliated with the synagogue, but um, I gained a lot of values and wisdom from my parents who are from Europe and, um, we [00:08:00] traditionally were Jews. We lit candles on Friday night, but we never went to synagogue.

But I have, my parents had deep integrity and love for Judaism and, um, they were, their family were survivors of the Holocaust, so, um, they believed very strongly in justice and compassion and, and certainly hope and instilled that in us.

Yarden: Yeah. I'm sure. I wanna go back to what you were saying, um, on question two about wisdom to your childhood self.

Do you think that you showed a lot of balance between risk versus utility? Do you think that you showed a lot of that in childhood? 

Sheldon: If I could define it more, you will understand it better. And that is, I learned very early on because of various reasons in family, that if I did something wrong, the punishment was extremely severe.

So I learned to [00:09:00] balance doing wrong, but not too wrong. And I found out that if it wasn't too wrong, that punishment wasn't too bad. And I gained from that and used it all in my adult life that whatever the risk was that I was taking, whatever the risk was, uh, spending too much money and not being nice to a date, messing up on the ball field.

There was always a risk involved with that. So I learned to balance, to do better so that the risk wasn't as great. And I learned it very young and it, uh, it's with me now this moment, and I've, I taught my grandchildren and friends and children that they need to look at life in that context. 

Yarden: That's interesting.

Do you think, Nolan, you played baseball too. Do you think that you see a lot of that balance that Sheldon is talking [00:10:00] about between the risk and reward? 

Nolan: I mean, yeah, absolutely. Uh, anytime you make an error, there's always gonna be a situation that that's gonna lead to, whether that leads to scoring a run or your pitchers having to pitch more.

There's always a consequence to what you make and that happens in your everyday life. I mean, if you do something wrong, there's gonna be a consequence no matter what. So you, as Sheldon said, just gotta balance it out and try to minimize the damage. 

Yarden: Aviva, do you see this, this the same risk and reward within theater? Because I know you do theater and there's definitely some ups and downs and… 

Aviva: Yeah, I think there's totally a lot of that within theater, especially like the, a lot of times it's like the higher risk, the higher reward, just because when you, um, put yourself out there, 'cause it's such a vulnerable place and the more vulnerable I've found to be is the more receptive other people are towards that.

And so balancing that out for me is [00:11:00] trying to like, find how much I need to share in order to still get connection without like one or the other being too strong. 

Yarden: Yeah. Do you wish that your teenagehood was different? Sheldon? 

Sheldon: I wish my, uh, teenage different was much different. I had an older brother and a younger sister.

Uh, there is a middle child syndrome that you'll read about when you're in school if you take psych. I wish that I was the older or the younger because that's where the attention went. So I was deprived in my opinion of uh, a tremendous amount of, uh, stuff that could have been shared between the three of us, but it wasn't.

Yarden: How much of an age gap were you guys? 

Sheldon: My brother's 18 months older than I. And my sister is about four years younger. My brother had asthma, which he feigned and he got a tremendous amount of attention because of it. And my sister was extremely [00:12:00] spoiled and got everything at any time that she wanted.

Um, so there was a lot of left out by myself. 

Yarden: Yeah, I'm sure. I think sometimes when siblings show a lot of attention, I can definitely see it from my perspective, not. I don't have the same experience with you, but just having an older brother that's very smart and having to compare yourself to that. And so for you, like not getting the same attention, it's definitely like that.

And I think Nolan has the same thing with, 

Nolan: uh, I have a twin sister and we are the two complete opposite kids. She's very book smart and I'm very common sense smart, where she's the opposite. Uh, no offense to her, but runs in the doors, walls. It is what it is. We love her for that. Everyone's got their differences, but we've learned to balance that out [00:13:00] and, uh, she's always been the academic one.

So growing up, I looked up to her. I was like, man, how can I be like her? She's getting all A’s, she's acing all of her tests and I was really struggling, especially during the COVID years. So I always looked towards her and try to compare myself, which in the long run really hurt my progression. 

Yarden: Yeah. I think what, um, Thelma was saying about making mistakes, I think sometimes the quote, “comparison is the thief of joy.”

If we continue comparing ourselves and trying to be that bigger person like our siblings, then it doesn't work and we're not allowing ourselves to make mistakes that we need to make to grow. 

Thelma: Yeah. Uh, oh. I was the oldest of four, four girls. Oh. And I had a, I did a lot of caretaking, but yet I still wanted to be a nurse, which I became, and a, a wife and a mother and a grandmother, and a great-grandmother.

And, um, [00:14:00] so I guess I'm still caretaking. Um, but it's taken its toll. Right now at my age, almost 83 I wanna play and I wanna just be free of the caretaking responsibilities, and I'm doing a lot of that. I'm exploring the art that I wanted to be, the artist I wanted to be. Um, just being with friends and doing things by myself and I'm just loving life right now.

Yarden: Aviva, do you feel, you have a bigger age gap with your sister, but do you still feel that like comparison or…?

Aviva: Yeah. I mean, sometimes my sister's, um, four years older than I am in school and three and a half out of school. So I think there wasn't a lot of time for me to compare myself to her because we were never at the same stage, um, at the same time.

But I remember like when she was a sophomore in high [00:15:00] school, which I am right now, I was like, oh, sophomore year is gonna be easy. It was easy for her and not for me. And like, I think I had a pretty negative middle school experience and a really good high school experience, and she had the opposite. And so I think a lot of times I feel like I'm exactly following her footsteps, 'cause the second she graduated, I went into high school and we're gonna graduate college and high school at the same she within the same week. And so I think that I'm grateful to have her to like follow, but I'm also really grateful that I didn't have to like, go through the same exact things the same exact time 'cause that would like lead to a lot more comparison. 

Thelma: I would just like to say one more thing. Um, I don't know if it's apropos, but um, in our family we were not competitive with school grades and such. Um, and one of the wisdoms that I got from my father was when I'd come home, oh, I got, A's I got B's I was all excited to show him my [00:16:00] report card.

He'd say, that's all in good. But what did you get in physical education? 

Hmm? 

He said, I wanna know that you're a team player. I wanna know you're a good sport. I wanna know you're a good citizen. I wanna know that you play by the rules. Play by the rules. And, um, those were very important lessons for me that I passed on to my, our children.

That the grades weren't the most important thing - just to be a good human being, good citizen, good sport. 

Yarden: No, I think that's really important. 

Aviva, what's a Jewish value that sticks out to you and means a lot to you? 

Aviva: Ooh. I don't know. I think I'm kind of rediscovering all of the Jewish values I grew up hearing, because I'm teaching them to a bunch of fifth graders right now.

Mm-hmm. Um, and so I'm the ones at the forefront of my brain are the ones I've been teaching lately. One that's always I've loved is, I think it's, Hesed, but I don't know if that's loving kindness. Um, and I noticed this on Sunday. I mentioned this, that loving [00:17:00] kindness is one word. And so I think that became my favorite because I loved the fact that it wasn't like separating love and kindness and you kind of, it's like a, a relationship between those two things that like has to be there for both of them to be genuine.

Yarden: I love that love. I think loving kindness is something that also speaks a lot to me of, I just think kindness means everything to someone. You never know what someone's going through. You never know what's what story they have to tell, what story they've been through. And so just having that loving kindness like just makes someone’s day in ways that you don't even know. 

Thelma: In our synagogue, we have a committee called the Hesed Committee, of which I'm on, and you're right, it, it means so much. I send out cards, e-cards mostly to people who have had, um, deaths in their family or a baby, or I just sent one to, um, [00:18:00] Kevin Wilk, who's our new mayor of Wal - Walnut Creek.

And I'm getting such wonderful responses. I don't sign up my name, I sign up the Chesed Committee. Mm-hmm. But, um, so loving kindness and caring really is important. 

Nolan: Something that's always been really important to me in, uh, childhood and now is Tzedakah and giving back. You can give back with items, material, or your time.

I mean, you can volunteer at a shelter or anywhere for no money whatsoever. Or you can donate to an organization. It's so flexible, the word tzedakah. And I've always grew up with a tzedakah box in my house and in my room. And once a year I donate money, I save up to do an oncology camp, which I've always felt, felt very powerful about and I love to do.

So I feel like that's a powerful one just because of the flexibility it has. 

Yarden: Beautiful. It's awesome [00:19:00] speak more Um, about the oncology camp, what made you have that passion?

Nolan: uh, my dad's been working there for over 25 years. I'm actually not old enough to be a counselor, anything there. 

Sheldon: Mm-hmm. 

Nolan: Um. But it's in Huntington Lake and, uh, we've always had a strong connection to children's cancer.

I lost my best friend to cancer in 2022, right before my B’nei Mitzvah, which was, uh, really hard for me. But he was also Jewish too. He was gonna go to that camp. And that camp since then has just meant a little something more. And my Dad always tells us the importance about giving back to the community.

He's from Fresno and a lot of the kids are, um, uh, don't have the most money. So I feel like I'm making a difference when I'm letting a kid go up for a week and forget about his troubles or his, or her troubles at the hospital and [00:20:00] just enjoy their life. 

Yarden: I feel like that needs a few, like a moment of silence, of just like, like how deep and powerful it is.

I think it sh that's a perfect example of how tzedakah of like time and the little things, the little acts make such a difference in people's lives and just, I don't know. I think with me, a big thing has been Better Together. I, this is my fifth year of Better Together, my last year. I'm not gonna cry, but just I love it.

I love it so much. I didn't know that I would, I am very fortunate to still have all my grandparents, but I didn't know that I would adopt a, a few more, and each time I get closer with you guys and I get to know you guys more than I feel like I get another grandparent. Um, and just learning your stories and learning everyone else's stories, I just, I think it's so powerful.

And the, the whole point of the [00:21:00] different generations coming together, I think that's the most important thing. 

Aviva: L’Dor Vador

Nolan: I completely agree with what you just said. I've been in Better Together for three years now, and I'm, I've loved every moment of it. I've met some of the nicest people and all of my story, all of their stories I reflect on and then I'm able to learn from.

And I just feel like I've benefited so much in the three years I've been here. 

Sheldon: There is something I'd like to share, and that is, this is my opinion, but it is extremely personal to me, and that is loving kindness, which you said was so important to you, is extremely important. But the interesting thing in my mind is that I too, I welcome and I cherish Tzedakah, and the reason for that is, um, several fold, but mainly it's because Tzedakah is an act that you actually do.

It's, it's, [00:22:00] it's not innate. You learn to give you, you, you, you must act when you give either, uh, saving a penny or putting money into the Salvation Army Kettle as the person there is ringing the bell, the Christmas bell, loving kindness, I think is innate. We're born with it. It's thousands of years old.

It's a natural tendency for a human being to be loving and kind. But Tzedakah requires an act and there needs to be more acts of Tzedakah. Especially now in your world, you young people's world, so many people are in need more than when I was your age. So that's why I love Tzedakah too. 

Yarden: Do you wanna expand more upon why, like, why do you think that we need Tzedakah more?

Sheldon: Because the world is a very different place than when I was your age. There are [00:23:00] more people in need. And, uh, it's very simple that Tzedakah relates to need and it's got to be addressed and recognized and acted upon. Can't walk by somebody who's on the street just because they're smoking a cigarette. If they don't have any clothes on, you have to, if you have a dollar, you've gotta give them a dollar.

If they're, uh, out in the rain, you have to help 'em. So it's totally objective. Giving has to be totally objective and it has to, you have to understand that it's an act. It's not innate. You've got to develop the ability to give, in my opinion. 

Thelma: I read a quote and I think it's apropos. I slept and dreamt that life was joy.

I awoke and saw that life was service. I acted and behold service was joy. 

Sheldon: Yeah. [00:24:00] 

Aviva: What I was gonna ask is, do you think it also takes loving kindness to do the Tzedakah? Like do you think that's what motivates or other things that would motivate the um, the like conscious giving? 

Sheldon: It's a very good question. Very good question.

Um, I think that Tzedakah may not necessarily require or need, although it's nice when it's there. I love giving, but you've gotta be careful that you're not altruistically giving for the satisfaction of, oh boy, do I feel good? Do I feel loving? Giving has to be giving because of the need that's there. So sometimes it doesn't require loving, it just requires the terrible need that the person that you're helping has.

Good question though. But they do overlap, I think. Good question. 

Yarden: Interesting. You said that you were a nurse. I think that gives very [00:25:00] much into Tzedakah and you taking your time and your career choice about helping other people. Do you wanna talk more about what made you, you said you had four 

Thelma: siblings.

Yarden: Siblings three. 

Thelma: Yeah. Three. Um, well, I remember when I was 12 or 13, um, we had a, remember this many years ago, 60 years ago, um, we had a family doctor, a general practitioner who made house calls and we haven't heard of that these days. Um, he was not only just our GP, our general practitioner, but he was like our psychiatrist and delivered babies and everything.

And I remember for my 12th to 13th, um, physical checkup, he said, so have you thought about what you might wanna do in your. With your life. Life. Remember then we didn't, women didn't have a lot of choices. We could be a teacher, a nurse, um, [00:26:00] not too many choices. So, um, I said, well, I wanna be an artist. And he said, well, if you're an artist, he said, why don't you think about maybe being a nurse or a teacher?

Because then you can still be an artist. But if you're an artist, you won't have the education to be a nurse or a teacher. So I sort of took that path of nursing and um, unfortunately, um, I had a sister who passed away very young. She was seven. And I had another sister who was born Down Syndrome. So I had a lot of experience 'cause, and I was the eldest and we were quite a few years in between, um, coping with those kinds of issues.

And, um. Yeah. And I, I've had an incredible journey with the nurse nursing. It opened so many doors and, um, everything from giving life, labor and delivery to hospice, which is death and [00:27:00] everything in between. And I was a movie set nurse for about 15 years. I sold out to nursing and I was living in Hollywood. Um, what could I do?

I could be a nurse on the movie set. So that was fun. 

Aviva: That's absolutely awesome. I think so. Cool. 

Yarden: Aviva and I, you just like perked our ears because I personally wanna go into therapy, but I love art, and I wanna be an artist and so like, I'm very, very similar to you of like, what do you wanna do? I've always wanted to be, be an artist, but then I'm gonna do therapy because.

It's a job and it will pay the bills. But 

Thelma: you can still be an artist. 

Yarden: But I can still be an artist. So I just, I think my ears perked up when you said that, when I feel so closely with that because those are the two passions that I love. And Aviva, when you said set and she loves theater. And 

Aviva: I also, I liked that the idea that you could do two things at once and that's something that I wanna do as well.

Um, 'cause I wanna, I was torn between [00:28:00] theater and teaching, but I wanna be a theater teacher so I can do both. So I really like resonate with that. 

Yarden: And you could be an art therapist, an art. Exactly. 

Thelma: Just find anything you wanna be. You could be let anyone shrink you 

Yarden: just, I love, yeah. 

Thelma: The world is open for you.

Yarden: I agree. I think there, especially now, there's always like, when you're little, you're like, oh, I wanna be a firefighter. I wanna be a, a superhero 

Nolan: astronaut. 

Aviva: I wanna be the tooth fair. 

Yarden: And then, and then you get older. But I think there's still so many possibilities that you can still be an astronaut or a, a firefighter.

And I wish that we could, that we still, I guess my advice to teens is do what you want. It's what you're saying of like, do the passions that you love. Do what, do what makes you happy. Don't settle for less than that. 

Aviva: Nolan, what does it mean to you to be part of [00:29:00] Better Together? 

Nolan: I'm loving it, and I will be here until I'm 18 and hopefully after.

Thelma: We really love you. 

Nolan: Hope so. Thank you. Hope so. 

Yarden: Um, from my anonymous sources, um, it says that your grandfather is a rabbi. That's correct. Um, does that, do you think that's affected your Judaism or do you wanna answer this question? You could say no, should scratch it. 

Nolan: Uh, he, he was a rabbi. Uh, he worked in San Leandro and the V.A. in the little temple in Brentwood.

I, I remember when I was really little, like I was three, four, he'd take me to the Veteran’s Home and, uh, uh, some of his synagogues and. I would wear, I still have the first yamaka he ever gave me, and it's a green yarmalka with pur purple. Used to be my favorite color. It's [00:30:00] got purple flowers on it. Uh, I still wear it sometimes when I go to synagogue, but it gave me a sense of my beliefs and got me closer to God, and I loved that.

Uh, like I remember, uh, when I was six, he took me to the Veteran's Home and he still has it pinned on his wall and they'll send me a picture. I made a little sticky note and I wrote World's Youngest Rabbi at the V.A. and I wore it around so proudly, and he has it up on his wall. And I, that day, like I, one time he took me the driving range up there, but I would always go in and listen to his sermons in front of whether it be four or 200. I'd listen to all his sermons all the time and I loved being able to get closer to my religion and learn about all the stories he had and all the sermons and uh, some of the prayers and yeah, it was awesome. 

Yarden: Aviva, you've been doing [00:31:00] Sunday school. Did you used to do Sunday school when you were young and do you think that's impacted your Judaism?

Aviva: Yes, actually Nolan and I were in the same Sunday school collapse. 

Nolan: I was never a good Sunday school student and I'll admit that I was always trying to be funny and I kind of regret that. But I did love my B’nai Mitzvah, I was really meaningful. And the video's still up on YouTube and sometimes I watch it and people have found that and I'll be like, is this you?

I'm like, I'll say, tell 'em probably. Yeah, that's me. And I worked on the tour and I still am very proud of myself for that 'cause. There were some times where I thought like I didn't want to go through it and finish it and have a B’nei Mitzvah and I really loved having it, so I'm grateful that I did that.

Thelma: Have you had a bat mitzvah? 

Aviva: I did, yes. Um, yeah, I loved my Bat Mitzvah. I thought it was a lot of fun. Um, and I loved the whole process of it because I would get at it [00:32:00] that white piece and good at, but truly like I felt really connected to like kind of everything. Like just seeing the tour for the first time, I was like, wow, countless people have looked at this and seeing the same words I am, but have interpreted them differently.

And I loved meeting with the rabbi and kind of the whole process of it, including going to Sunday school. 'cause I went Sunday school every Sunday since I could like know what a Sunday was. So like growing up with this like group of people and I found it was just so special. It made me feel really connected.

And sometimes we wouldn't get any learning done, but. We would talk to each other and we would learn about each other. And I think that was also like, probably equally as valuable as the education we were getting. And so I love doing that and I love teaching it now to carry that on and try to like influence other people's lives as mine was.

Yarden: Do you guys have a bat mitzvah or, 

Sheldon: I was not fortunate enough to have one. I would've loved to have had one, but we belonged to a very, very [00:33:00] reformed temple. And we only went to Temple on Yom Kippur and uh, uh, Rosh Hashanah. So it was a very, very reformed, very famous temple in Los Angeles, California. And I would've loved to have, we went to Sunday school for a little while, but uh, folks didn't promote it.

Uh, they weren't, uh, that interested in it. So I, uh, maybe I will still do it though. 

Nolan: I just wanted to point out at my B’nei mitzvah, I believe a Aviva was the only one of my classmates who came. And stood on the Bima and read some prayers with us, and that was awesome. And here's another thing about my, uh, Zadie who's a rabbi.

His Torah is in the center of the arc at, uh, Beth Chaim, it may look light. And because it's the smallest one there, no, it was twice as heavy as the bigger ones. And speaking [00:34:00] from experience, I, I think I might have carried that around and I did carry it around twice. It's very heavy. Uh, I didn't get the chance to read from it, which would've been awesome, but it's always a pleasure when they opened the arc and I see his Torah right, right in front there.

So, yeah. 

Yarden: Hmm. Thelma, did you have a bat mitzvah?

Thelma:  I did not. 

Yarden: Maybe you guys should do opening. Yeah, we could. 

Sheldon: Not. A bad idea of any of you. We'll all come. 

Thelma: Right. I did not have a religious education. Like I said, traditionally we were Jews at home lit candles, um, had family dinners. And when I was a youth at 11 or 12, my best girlfriend was Christian.

And um, she used to invite me to come to her youth group and she was Baptist and they're very, um, wanting to join their plan. And I remember my mom saying, [00:35:00] well, you're not gonna continue going to her's group until you learn more about your own faith. And um, so they put my sister and I, who were closer of age on a bus and sent us to Mishkan Tefilu to fellow, which was an orthodox synagogue in Santa Monica.

And the women, well, you know, everybody was separated but they didn't speak a word English. And I remember coming home crying. We used, don't make a ow there, you know, it was horrible and blah, blah, blah. So my father 

or my mom bought 

this 

wonderful 

comic book, old Testament in comic form. And on Sunday mornings, my sisters and I would lay in bed with my dad.

Read from the comic while my mom was making breakfast. And um, that's how we learned our Bible stories. And when we broke, when my parents passed away a few years ago, we broke down their house. I looked for that book and I didn't find it, but, um, I need to go online and [00:36:00] see. But it was the thick bible stories in comic book form that was such a cherished memory, was fabulous.

Yarden: Absolutely. From 

Thelma: one. And that's how I learned Jewish  stories

Yarden: Feel like just got like your own Sunday school. You guys just made your own Sunday school basically it was 

Thelma: we, that was, we laid in bed with my dad and he'd read us those stories and every Sunday we, we couldn't wait. It was wonderful. Yeah. 

Yarden: I'm with you.

If you ever find that comic book, send it, send the link to us. We wanna see it. 

I think for me, Judaism has never, uh, we've never been very religious. We never like. We're the kind of people I will admit, we show up to synagogue late and we leave early. We only stay for a little bit of time, but we…

Nolan: That’s us too.

Yarden: Aviva will see us sometimes we come in for a little bit and then we get very done after a few seconds. But that's okay. We've always, we celebrate, [00:37:00] we celebrate everything, but it's more of just, it's my family does it. We do it very together. We celebrate, um, Shabbat together. We light the candles and it's always been less about going to synagogue for me, but more about just like spending that time with your family.

And so I think it's really important to me thinking back to like Yom Kippur it's the day where we do a very silly tradition of. We're fasting all day, but we just watch movies. We just watch movies a day. Like for 24 hours you're watching all the movies that you can. And yes, we'll go to a little bit of synagogue, but, um, just, it's such a core memory to me of being together and you're not allowed to do work.

You don't do anything. But it's just having that togetherness and being like, it's spending that time by saying, sorry that you didn't get to spend time with others. And so it's like, for us, it's that togetherness. And so I had, um, a B’nei mitzvah with my brother and I was very [00:38:00] fortunate to have that, but it was.

I'm a COVID baby, so I had that on Zoom. I had it outside. I used to live in Houston, so in a hundred degree heat. 

Sheldon: Wow. 

Yarden: It was brutal. Very, very hot. That's the thing that I remember the most. We had outside an air conditioning unit and four fans because it was just so hot outside. But it was a memorable experience and I will never forget it.

We weren't just being able to do it with my brother and being able to do it, um, with my family around. Even though it was COVID, I still, both of my grandparents were there and I just, I feel so fortunate for that. And I just feel like same with Midrasha, has really connected me to my Judaism. It's like created a place where I can express freely and it's nice because it's helped me.

Be confident in being Jewish and starting now. I am president of Jewish Student Union and just like [00:39:00] having the confidence to speak up and say I am Jewish and don't, and make room for me because I used to be in a Christian private school that was my elementary school, so they were never, we used to go to chapel every seven days and I used to sing all the Christmas songs and all the songs, and I'm sure I still know some of the Christmas prayers, but it never took away from my Judaism.

I would say that I still felt very strongly of being Jewish, but I think since moving here, I've just reconnected with it and I've come to it on a different level of just like pride in making sure that I have space to be Jewish and I show that. And so I do that in school and making sure that like we get representation and that's something that's really important to me.

Aviva: Did you guys grow up in areas with a lot of other Jewish kids? 

Thelma: I did not. Um, I grew up in Venice, California. It was very, it was a naturally integrated [00:40:00] community with ethnicity, but not Jews. Um, in my high school, there was 1% Jews. And um, I remember one thing, one of the things, I don't know if it was a question that we did as teens that we wanted to share that was bad, bad.

Um, my girlfriend who went to Santa Monica High School and I went to Venice, we made a pact that we were gonna ditch school and go look for Jewish boys of his school that he, Sheldon was older, but he wasn't in the school. But he went to a school called Fairfax, which was a very borsch belt Jewish area in Los Angeles.

And so she ditched her school, I ditched mine and we went to looking for Jewish boys at his school. And that's, that was… 

Yarden: What if you guys met? 

Thelma: But I would need, which did have been funny, 

Sheldon: I would just want to comment real quickly that I grew up in a totally gentile area. The only Jewish family on the block, so [00:41:00] Gentile, my parents would cook specifically on Friday night fish so that the neighbors up and down the block who cooked fish.

It was a tradition at that time for some gentile families, so that, uh, we wouldn't be, uh, so that they wouldn't be offended. My parents, uh, did that, but the High School that was some four or five miles away, as Thelma said, was 92% Jewish. So, and it was in a Jewish ghetto area, and that was, that was wonderful.

That was wonderful. 

Yarden: We have, I like to say like 15 Jews at our school. I feel, I feel like that's around 

Nolan: Monte Vista's Jewish Student Union. Uh, runs about six to eight kids per meeting. And I feel like I know almost all of the kids who are Jewish. Oh. Mm-hmm. Uh, uh, two of my friends parents are Jewish, but they never really [00:42:00] practice Judaism.

Neither of them are Bar Mitzvahed. Um, and so they don't really go to the meeting. So I go, but there's only about six to eight kids. Mm-hmm. 

Yarden: We are very fortunate. Um, Aviva represents, um, we have like 20 or 30 kids. No, no one's Jewish. I think about three people are Jewish there. But I think the whole point of Jewish Student Union for us is…

And like the slogan that I came to Aviva with from the start, I was like, I wanna make sure that people know you don't have to be Jewish to join JSU. Like, that was the biggest thing that I told Aviva from the start. I was like, I wanna make sure that this is a community where people can learn, even if you're not Jewish, even if you're very religiously Christian.

Like our school is predominantly Christian and very religious, 

Nolan: A huge Christian club that runs. 

Thelma: Which high school?

Yarden: Santa Ramon Valley High School. 

Thelma: Oh, okay. I didn't mean to interrupt you. 

Yarden: No, I you're all good Thelma.

Nolan: Monte Vista got, they kicked the Christian club out of the room on accident, [00:43:00] so they came down to our lunch spot.

There was about fifty to a hundred kids. There's pizza and there's all this there. It's a big club. Big population at Monte Vista. Yeah. 

Yarden: Yeah. It's called Faith and Fellowship. 

Nolan: Yep. Faith and Fellowship Club. 

Yarden: Oh, so it's a very one. 

Aviva: The Christian Club, but us at our school. Yeah. So 

Yarden: Yeah, so, but I, I think it's really important and I think that's what's helped a lot is we have like 20 or 30 kids who came today to JSU and it's just like they get to learn a little bit and we play and we painted dreidels today and ate latkes.

And it may be a simple thing of just playing with dreidels or something, but just, just showing a different culture. I don't, we don't care if you're Christian, if you're Jewish, if you're Muslim. Like it doesn't matter what you affiliate with and what you believe, but as long as you're showing support, I think that's all that matters.

Nolan: Absolutely. 

Aviva: Yeah. I had a lot of curiosity when I, 'cause I was running the Jewish Student Union table at the um, [00:44:00] culture fair. Um, and that was quite the experience. 'cause a lot of people. Um, approached with curiosity and then some people, like, we have three different people come up to us and bite our dreidels 'cause they thought it was food.

And I was sitting like, how did you think that this dreidel was like a piece of candy? Like three people put our dreidels in their mouths. And I think I was just like, that's so interesting to me that they don't, they don't know something that I've like seen on my kitchen table for like a very long time. Um, but I think it makes me feel special that we're like, it makes it more of a community for the people who are Jews and our school and the people who, you know, like either wanna learn or have friends who are Jewish.

Yarden: Yeah. No, I think it's really important, and 

Thelma: I said this earlier, but I'm gonna just repeat that. As Jews, we can't let, and you teens can't let others shrink you that you deserves the space. [00:45:00] And, um. You know, now with all the antisemitism, it's important and I'm so proud of you that you're able to stand up and show I'm a Jew.

Yarden: Well, I think I've been very fortunate. I've had a lot of support, a lot of support. Like I, I would thank my leadership teacher because she's let me have these things. She's come to me with these, like, she's let me be Jewish. I would say, I think sometimes it's also the circumstances and so I would say I'm very lucky with like my family, but also just with the, the cards that I've been dealt where I'm allowed to, when I know in other schools, like you have to hide it and it's not like, it just, sometimes it kind of just depends on where you are and where like at they have swastikas at all on thing, and so it's like, it depends on where you are.

Yeah. And so I think I've been very lucky to been dealt a good card. 

Sheldon: I have a question, and I don't know if you'll [00:46:00] edit it out. But it's important to me either to get it now or at dinner or someplace. I need to know what you three young people perceive today, yesterday, last week, next month, with regard to what's going on, uh, with antisemitism at your age in your schools.

Yesterday, five or six students were arrested on a school up the street here in the area for making a swastika, uh, on the lawn in the, on the ball field. I don't know if you, they've been arrested and I don't know what's gonna happen, but what do you perceive as young people now with regard to what is going on with this issue?

Nolan: I've actually experienced a lot of antisemitism in my life, and that, especially in middle school, kids were immature. And I've heard jokes about some of the worst [00:47:00] Holocaust things regarded and directed towards me using my name. Those hurt, they hurt real bad and they still do. But I've learned to just have a thicker skin.

I see swastikas because almost every day, uh, whether that's in the bathroom or just like somewhere on the walls, but there's one bathroom where there's a big one and no one's removed it. 'cause it's kind of like hidden. It's on the backside of a door. It's there every time. So that one hurts. But what hurt really bad is, uh, seventh and eighth grade, I had a combined total of seven swastikas drawn in my yearbook.

Uh, so I whited them out. Sorry mom if you're listening to this, but whited them out and kind of just scribbled over some of them so. That, that hurt. But seventh grade on the baseball team, uh, I was a new team. I [00:48:00] wasn't good. I was small. I was a practice player. I had a lot of antisemitism coming my way. Uh, and it really hurt and I didn't know what to do about it.

Uh, I didn't really tell my mom. She though I was keeping it all bottled up and it was wrecking me. 

Sheldon: Mm. 

Nolan: Uh, but I remember my mom came up to me one day and she read, read my text, and the group chat was named Valdivia Gas Chambers. And there was a bunch more than that on this text chain. And I just had stopped responding and my mom checked it and she called the coach and gave him some words.

And some of the players got suspended for a while and they came back looking at me. And I remember the first little bit after that was really hard. But it stopped for a little bit and then came back, but not as bad. So since then, I've [00:49:00] built a thicker skin to it and I something no one should have to go through.

And it's horrible hearing that people wish you and your family strain were die in such a bad time in history. Uh, it hurts every time to hear it, but still happens. I still see it. It's still around in this world and it's an issue that needs to be changed. I mean, I saw, uh, that thing in the news, that's unacceptable.

Teenage kids probably thought they were filming something funny. It's never funny to bully someone on religion, race, gender, ethnicity, any of that. I mean, while I'm announcing before every game, I make sure to read something about race, gender, and equality, and how the game should be played with good sportsmanship.

I think that's the value everyone should have. There should be. All racism, antisemitism, all of this needs to be stopped. It is horrible. It is horrible to hear people [00:50:00] use such derogatory language at the expense of other people. It hurts me to hear, even if it's not directed at me. 

Sheldon: Thank you. 

Thelma: Beautiful. I, 

Yarden: I think I need a second.

Aviva: Oh yeah. 

Yarden: That like, just, sorry. No, don't be sorry. I think it's so powerful and just like, and this is the whole point of the podcast, I guess like, just going back to that, like, we wanna get those stories out because it's not okay. It's not okay for this to happen to you. And it's, it like no matter how many sorrys we say, or how much we try, like it's not okay.

This is not something that should be accepted and should be an acceptable thing. It doesn't matter what, what you're exactly what you're saying. Like it doesn't matter who you are or what you believe in, or what you wanna be or what, like it's not okay. It's not okay to discriminate against someone that's just like it, like I think it pisses me off.

I like, I [00:51:00] work so hard at my school like to do, to make sure that that does not happen. That is all of what I do. I am a part of Safe School ambassadors where I have been trained to learn to deal with bullying and I am head of a leadership committee where we represent different, um, cultures and so we hold different like accesses or the cultural fair and we help represent these different people and different clubs.

And so just, I think it hit me really close to home because that's something that I work so hard to prevent and so hard to combat. 

Nolan: I completely agree with that. I think the worst part about it is these kids think there's no harm. In saying what they're saying, there's no harm in doing what they're doing.

And it hurts. It hurts. Um, and it's at the expense of you. And when they think they're being funny or there's no harm in it, that's when you gotta [00:52:00] look at them and you're like, dude, what? 

Thelma: do they even understand? 

Nolan: Yeah. 

Thelma: What they're saying, what it means. I mean, I 

Yarden: think sometimes people don't, I don't think I feel like, like I've, from my personal experience, people just don't know.

Like I think sometimes they know and they're being really stupid. Like, so do you, we need to understand words do matter. Words absolutely affect. The, the saying like, sticks and stones don't break your bones, but words can never hurt you. I, I think that's so untrue. 'cause I think words are the thing that impact you the most because it's the things that are repeating in your head and the things that you think about before you go to sleep and think about when you wake up.

And I think it just, it creates the most effect on someone. And so, um, I think in some ways some people just don't know, some people with the Holocaust. Um, I don't think it's acceptable, but I don't think that a lot of people are educated to it. 

Nolan: Yeah. Uh, we kids, like when they taught [00:53:00] the Holocaust in eighth grade, that was hard to watch.

Uh, they showed some pretty graphic images of Torahs being burned and, and stuff and it's history. So it's part of what the course is. I enjoyed learning about it and not in the dark way, but just to like kind of learn about and that. But there were kids who would laugh during the presentations, and it's shocking to know that people don't know one of the biggest and worst things ever happened in human history.

And I think more people should be informed and know about it. 

Yarden: I think our, um, from my experience, our advanced English teacher did the best job in explaining it. We read the book Maus my sophomore year and Aviva's just going through it. And I think that was the best curriculum that I've ever had on the Holocaust and just learning about it and reading that story and I just, I can't explain it.[00:54:00] 

Nolan: Yeah, both of those two Maus books are really well written. 

Thelma: Um. We talked about it on Sunday that somebody at the Holocaust Remembrance, um, service at Temple Isaiah last year said that she was in AP History class and they never even just talked about the Holocaust yet.

Nolan: Yeah, I'm in AP world history as well and we haven't come close to that.

I don't know if it's 'cause we're not in that time in history, but if they don't talk about it at all, that's 

Yarden: yeah. 

Nolan: Gonna be a thing. 

Yarden: Do we have any closing thoughts, any comments?

Thelma: cWell, time is precious and fleeting and do what matters. Choose your friends wisely. And again, you have your whole lives ahead of you and, um, you don't need to know now.

Like I said in the beginning, what is on the other end? Just be safe, happy trails. We love you. We. Yeah. And, uh, [00:55:00] 

Nolan: You're your own person. So like you make your decisions, don't give in other people and what they're trying to tell you, whether that's a dumb idea or a good idea, you make your decision play stupid games you win stupid prizes. 

Sheldon: I'll go back to one thing that, that you might have alluded to, but I really don't think any of you really understand it, so I'll just emphasize it and hope that it stays with you. It's so easy to forget things that are important, so much going on in the world for you, young people. Um, so much technology that's taking away from, uh, not only who you are, but who you can be, probably who you've been, uh, based on some of the criticisms of technology.

But this is extremely important, so listen to it well, from a 90-year-old.

I started working at 13 and a [00:56:00] half years old and I stopped working at about 85, 84 years old. So that's, that's a lot of jobs. That's a lot of work. It's a lot of getting up and going to work. It's a lot of paychecks. Some good, some bad, some, a lot of bosses telling you what to do, what not to do. A lot of not finding a parking space, A lot of walking in the rain to the job.

And what I've learned from that is the following, and this is the diamond. And if you hang onto it and wear it like a diamond, it will be with you all the time. And that's this. Find out what it is that you love to do. Find out what it is in your work that you love to do. And you will get better [00:57:00] at it. And if you don't love what you're doing, leave the job and get another one.

Because if you love what you're doing, it will expand who you are. It'll give you good health. It'll give you satisfaction. It'll give you the ability to give to others, which is the key in life. If you don't like what you're doing, you'll get sick and you'll do things that you are sorry for and you will not be happy.

So love what you do and change the job if at all possible, to find something that you do love. And I can tell you from experience that in all the years that I worked, finally, finally, finally. I got on the job the last job, 20 years. I found what I love to do won't tell you, but next time I will. But all of those other years, I was not happy [00:58:00] doing what I was doing until I found what I loved doing.

And I really got good at it and I loved it. Thank you. 

Yarden: No, now we need to know we 

Nolan:  You got to tell us. Next episode.

Sheldon: Next episode is right. 

Thelma: I just wanted to also say that shelter brought up technology and AI. Um, yeah. Yeah. Don't use No, it don't. Don't, don't let technology use, I mean, you can use technology but don't let it use you.

Mm-hmm. And that the human connection that we have can never replace the computers, the phones, the AI or whatever you guys are into now. Gals, guys. Yeah. 

Sheldon: Good point. Important. We, we, 

Thelma: We, we - the thread is the human connection and that's what I love about Better Together, you know, just being with you young folks and although we have our [00:59:00] grandchildren, this is very special.

You do us. Thank you. Take, thank you. That a spark to my life. 

Yarden: Thank you guys so much for coming. Thank you. Thank you 

Sheldon: for your time. Thank you. Thank 

Thelma: you. What are you talking about? 

Sheldon: Thank you for sharing with us 

Thelma: Your vision. Our pleasure.

Yarden: Thank you for listening to Vina from Contra Costa. I'm your host and lead producer, Yarden Crane. Our senior producer and editor is Andrew Sims. Our associate producer is Aviva Feder. Our producer is Julia Kurzrock, and our executive producers are Devra Aarons, Aron Korney, Shahnti Brook, and Rob Goldman. We also want to thank our funders, Sinai and Synapsis Contra Costa Jewish Community Center, an anonymous, prominent national foundation and the wider Midrasha community for making this show possible.

If you want to donate so we can make more episodes or have [01:00:00] questions for our team, email shalom@binapod.com or visit Binapod.com. Our Bina Better Together podcast presents candid interviews and personal stories, including memories, opinions, reflections, and personal information. These conversations are shared from each speaker's perspective whenever we edit for length and clarity good faith efforts are made to reserve the accuracy and intent of express statements. All subjective views and opinions expressed on air are those of the individual speakers, and do not necessarily reflect those of contra cost human content, the student hosts, the production team, or any affiliated individuals and organizations.

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